1st message (Begins in the middle of one persons multible replies to various topics)

> It's asinine! It's debased! It's science
> fiction--I guess, because this picture sure does not represent an America I
> know, and so must represent a parallel world.

/Shouldn't an "or" be inserted after "debased" and before "It's science
/fiction"?

/Unless you think that SF is debased and asinine, but in that case why
/did you subscribe to this list?

/(ok, I suppose it was just a case of hasty writing, and I appreciate the
/Sf-nal reading because the scene you described seems rather unrealistic
/to me too--especially after the OJ Simpson case...)

/Now another request:  surely the vast majority of the members are
/american, so there's a lot of talk about US TV Sf serials (some of
/them, like Star Trek and The Twilight Zone, arrived also here in
/Italy... but some were never able to cross the Atlantic--or the
/Channel), so I invite European members to discuss Space 1999 (it was
/British wasn't it) and U.F.O. (I wonder where did it came from, but
/since it has never been quoted I suspect it was not born in the
/USA), and to loyally the Commander Striker Fan Club.


What a can of worms to open Umberto !!!. UFO (which is currently being repeated
in the UK on the BBC, although it was originally made by and Independent TV
company ) was part of the "stable" of Jerry Anderson.

He was responsible for many of the highlights of my TV childhood,
Fireball XL5
Supercar
Stingray
Thunderbirds

and later , (I was too old to watch :-( , not that I didn't want to but I had
to work )

Space 1999
UFO
Joe 90
Captain Scarlet


In the mid 60s his company , Century 21 Productions produced a comic called
TV21 which carried strips based on the TV series as well as "real" science
ie Diagrams of satellites and launchers etc.

You have evoked memories of me running home from school so I would not miss the
start of Fireball XL5 or Stingray ,(Supercar preceded them and was aimed at
"kids" of less than 6 !!).

I now weep for my lost innocence



Date:    Fri, 17 Jan 1997 13:55:43 +0000
From:    
Subject: Re: TV SF?

> Since the age of about 21 (twenty years ago), I have NEVER been
> intellectually challenged by a science fiction television show.
>

That means you haven't seen the 1st episode of Space 1999.  It was an
intellectual challenge in its own way.

And do not forget Twin Peaks.

"A commission is appointed
To confer with a Volscian commission
About perpetual peace"--and nobody told me!



Date:    Fri, 17 Jan 1997 10:58:58 -0400
From: 
Subject: Space 1999

You know, there was a Space 1999 show in the US about 15-20 years ago --
wasn't that the one with Moon Base Alpha, Barbara Bain and Martin Landau?
I could be completely off-base with the show premise, but I -think- that
was it -- in any case, there was definitely a show by that same name in
the US, so it wasn't a British import...  I'm sure that someone on the
list has all the skinny, as I am probably totally wrong on the details
(as usual....sigh =.\  )



Date:    Fri, 17 Jan 1997 10:09:23 -0600
From:
Subject: Re: Space 1999

 wrote:
> (Quotes entire last message)

Actually, although the show aired in the U.S. (and still does in the
middle of the night in re-run syndication), I believe it was a Canadian
series.



Date:    Fri, 17 Jan 1997 16:25:37 +0000
From:
Subject: Re: Space 1999

I am afraid you might be off base on Space 1999, yes , the one with Martin
Landau, Barbara Bain and Moon Base Alpha. It was made here in blighty,
probably Shepperton but possibly Pinewood Studios, I don't think there was
a lot of call for location filming :-) . There was an actress who played a
"shapeshifter" I think she described herself as a metamorph, but she changed
into various animals during the series. I cannot for the life of me remember
her name, but she was a British actress and Mr Landau and Ms Bain were the
"names" to enable Gerry Anderson to sell it to America.

The fx were cheap and not too good, but I read somewhere that George Lucas
consulted and then headhunted the technicians who created them,at the time
they were "cutting edge". I am probably off base here, because I can't place
where I read it. ;-( .

Regards



Date:    Fri, 17 Jan 1997 12:50:32 -0600
From:
Subject: Re: Space 1999

        The role of Maya, the shape-shifting alien, was played by
Catherine Schell.  Her character was introduced in "The Metamorph," the
first episode of the second (and final) season of _Space: 1999_; she
became a regular on the show.

        Derek Meddings, British SFXmeister extraordinaire--I am not being
sarcastic--did what I recall as pretty good special effects for the
series.  Far better, IMO, than those of the American series _Battlestar
Galactica_ which were supervised by the otherwise-brillian Douglas
Trumbull (who masterminded the SFX in _2001: A Space Odyssey_, and whose
1973 film _Silent Running_ is a great example of eco-science fiction).

        I always wished that something more had been done with the idea
of the moon being used as a dumping ground for nuclear waste, beyond
causing a big explosion that set the plot going...



Date:    Fri, 17 Jan 1997 13:51:51 -0600
From:
Subject: Re: Space 1999

At 04:25 PM 1/17/97 +0000, you wrote:
>I am afraid you might be off base on Space 1999, yes, the one with Martin
>Landau, Barbara Bain and Moon Base Alpha. It was made here in blighty,
>probably Shepperton but possibly Pinewood Studios, I don't think there was
>a lot of call for location filming.  There was an actress who played a
>"shapeshifter" I think she described herself as a metamorph, but she
>changed into various animals during the series.

I think the US distributors had dropped it by the time the "shapeshifter"
was introduced.  At least I never saw any signs of her, and I'm sure I'd
have continued to watch as long as it was on.  Back in the seventies I was
still a teenager, and there wasn't a lot of SF to choose from on the
television.  As I recall, Battlestar Galactica was an exciting event!



Date:    Fri, 17 Jan 1997 11:14:25 +0000
From:
Subject: Re: TV SF?

> > Since the age of about 21 (twenty years ago), I have NEVER been
> > intellectually challenged by a science fiction television show.

> That means you haven't seen the 1st episode of Space 1999.  It was an
> intellectual challenge in its own way.
> And do not forget Twin Peaks.

Are you being sarcastic, Umberto?  Intellectual challenge in Space
1999?  The only thing challenging in that series was stifling my gag
reflex every time Landau or Baines came on the screen.

And are you really suggesting that Twin Peaks was SF?

Cheers,



Date:    Sat, 18 Jan 1997 06:53:50 -0800
From: 
Subject: Re: Space 1999

        Derek Meddings, British SFXmeister extraordinaire--I am not being
>sarcastic--did what I recall as pretty good special effects for the
>series.  Far better, IMO, than those of the American series _Battlestar
>Galactica_ which were supervised by the otherwise-brillian Douglas
>Trumbull (who masterminded the SFX in _2001: A Space Odyssey_, and whose
>1973 film _Silent Running_ is a great example of eco-science fiction).
>
>        I always wished that something more had been done with the idea
>of the moon being used as a dumping ground for nuclear waste, beyond
>causing a big explosion that set the plot going...
>
>
_________________________________________________________________
The special effects for SPACE: 1999 were done by Brian Johnston (ALIEN,
EMPIRE STRIKES BACK, SPACE TRUCKERS). The series was British made, not
Canadian, as was the UFO series. (My favorite British SF series thus far is
RED DWARF, with occasional episodes of Dr. Who). It might have been
interesting if SPACE: 1999 had been scientifically realistic, as an
explosion capable of moving the moon out of its orbit and past alien
planets would have involved so much force that the inhabitants would have
been turned into maribone jelly. That way we would not have had to put up
with the continued wooden acting of Bain, Landau (he got better), and Barry
Morse, the dull-lifeless scripts (although "Space Brain," where Moonbase
Alpha was attacked by a carwash or Mr. Bubble did send me into paroxysms of
derisive laughter when I first saw it, so I suppose the series was good for
something).



Date:    Sat, 18 Jan 1997 16:45:05 +0000
From: 
Subject: Re: TV SF?  Not at all, TV fantasy

> And are you really suggesting that Twin Peaks was SF?

I'd rather include it in the fantasy field (this is a fantasy & SF
list isn't it).  Or you would like horror?  Anyway it ends with a
descent to hell, and one of the more impressive and disturbing I
have ever seen--provided that the smalltown where Lynch set the
story is not already a hell of sorts (the story seems to suggest it
is).

As for Space 1999, I was referring to the 1st episode, when Earth
loses her satellite.  It is a scene catastrophic enough to make you
think (and the catastrophe is triggered by problems with radioactive
waste disposal... well before Chernobyl!).  It's a pity the rest of
the series was not so amazing.

Well, obviously watching those images today could be disappointing.
Our standards about F/X are changed (though 2001 remains
unsurpassed--hope this term works...).


"A commission is appointed
To confer with a Volscian commission
About perpetual peace"--and nobody told me!



Date:    Sat, 18 Jan 1997 12:38:19 -500
From:    

           wrote:

>>
(1) Space Opera DOES NOT mean the same thing as "Bubblegum", but is a
respectable form of science fiction when understood in its own terms.
<<

Hmm. Let me get a clarification from those who would be more in the
know. I thought "space opera" was a term that did connote that which
is called bubblegum. To use a phrase from something I recently read,
where, unlabeled as such, I believe is was what the author was
referring to:

"This is precisely the caricature . . . which occurs with somewhat
less irony in some of the less sophisticated science fiction of
today, where an elaborate jargon of technical performance lards the
texts of otherwise bald romances" (Angus Fletcher, _Allegory_,
Cornell UP: Ithaca, 1964).

He's refferring to an extreme, but I believe it points to a certain
quality of space opera in that while it can be identified as a genre
with its own colleciton of tropes, it is little more than romance in
a distant setting, and is the phrase is thus as oft used as a
pejorative.

Do I have this wrong?

(#=)=

***********************************************
She cried 'Laura,' up the garden,
'Did you miss me?
Come and kiss me.
Never mind my bruises,
Hug me, kiss me, suck my juices
Squeezed from goblin fruits for you,
Goblin pulp and goblin dew.
Eat me, drink me, love me;
Laura, make much of me:
For your sake I have braved the glen
And had to do with goblin merchant men.'
                       Christina Rossetti



Subject: SF-TV, was Re: Equating writers... (A Time to Kill)

> Now another request:  surely the vast majority of the
> members are american, so there's a lot of talk about US TV
> Sf serials (some of them, like Star Trek and The Twilight
> Zone, arrived also here in Italy... but some were never able
> to cross the Atlantic--or the Channel), so I invite European
> members to discuss Space 1999 (it was British wasn't it) and
> U.F.O. (I wonder where did it came from, but since it has
> never been quoted I suspect it was not born in the USA), and
> to loyally the Commander Striker Fan Club.

        Both british, Umberto. I can even be willing to discuss them, but
I watched them some 20 years ago, when I was a kid that didn't even know
what intellectual stimulation was...



Date:    Sun, 19 Jan 1997 13:32:53 -0500
From:
Subject: Re: Space 1999

I watched 1999 back in the 70s and distinctly remember the shapeshifter. She
had these funky bumpy eyebrows. I believe that she was an alien that they ran
into in their travels.

U.S. Viewer



Date:    Mon, 20 Jan 1997 00:31:14 +0000
From:   
Subject: Re: Space 1999

> You know, there was a Space 1999 show in the US about 15-20 years ago --
>wasn't that the one with Moon Base Alpha, Barbara Bain and Martin Landau?
>I could be completely off-base with the show premise, but I -think- that
>was it -- in any case, there was definitely a show by that same name in the
>US, so it wasn't a British import...  I'm sure that someone on the list has
>all the skinny, as I am probably totally wrong on the details (as
>usual....sigh =.\  )

You know dis this show all you want but in its defence you have to
admit it scored high on the weird and original scale.  Sometimes by
the end of the episode I had still not figured out what had happened.
It was nice that some things had no easy explaination, ie. the adhoc
nuclear pulse FTL drive that does not pulp people.



Date:    Mon, 20 Jan 1997 09:31:24 GMT
From:
Subject: Re: Space 1999
On Fri, 17 Jan 1997 13:51:51 -0600       wrote:


> At 04:25 PM 1/17/97 +0000, you wrote:
> >I am afraid you might be off base on Space 1999, yes, the one with Martin
> >Landau, Barbara Bain and Moon Base Alpha. It was made here in blighty,
> >probably Shepperton but possibly Pinewood Studios, I don't think there
> >was a lot of call for location filming.  There was an actress who played
> >a "shapeshifter" I think she described herself as a metamorph, but she
> >changed into various animals during the series.
>

I don't know if anyone has said that Space 1999 (or Space Nineteen and
ninepence as it was dubbed because of the apparent budget costs on the
writing side) was produced by Gerry Anderson and was, I think, his first
major live-action - as opposed to puppet - production.

There seems to be a mini-revival of interest in it among media-sf fans,
which is interesting because my recollection of it (which was the standard
opinion among sf fans at the time) was that it was dreadful. It was the
archetype televised sf show which spent a lot of money on special effects
and had stories so stupid they challenged the intellectual capacity of a
10 year old. We expected scripts and acting which lived up to the challenge
of the effects and didn't contain logical and scientific errors so blatant
they simply spoiled the enjoyment of the show. We didn't get them. The
rumour was that at least one science fiction writer offered to vet the
scripts for accuracy and believability and was turned down flat.

Aren't audiences today charitable!



Date:    Mon, 20 Jan 1997 18:02:07 -0800
From:   
Subject: Space Opera and a statistical definition

Subject: Space Opera, was American TV

> >> (1) Space Opera DOES NOT mean the same thing as
> "Bubblegum", but is a respectable form of science fiction
> when understood in its own terms. <<

        I'm not sure I'm following the thread, here, but my definition of
space opera is an adventure set on at least one other planet and/or outer
space, whether in or out of our solar system. It may be something easy
(and empty), like Star Wars and the Lensman series by Doc Smith, or
something more substantial, like the Polesotechnic League and the Terran
Empire series by Poul Anderson.
        If bubblegum means something empty, ŕ la Star Wars, then space
opera may or may not mean bubblegum, depending on what you're referring
to...
        Or did I get this wrong?



Subject: Re: Space 1999

> I watched 1999 back in the 70s and distinctly remember
> the shapeshifter. She had these funky bumpy eyebrows. I
> believe that she was an alien that they ran into in
> their travels.

        Oh yes, so she was.



Date:    Tue, 21 Jan 1997 03:46:08 -0800
From:   
Subject: Re: Space 1999 (& U.F.O!)


>I don't know if anyone has said that Space 1999 (or Space Nineteen and
>ninepence as it was
>dubbed because of the apparent budget costs on the writing side) was
>produced by Gerry
>Anderson and was, I think, his first major live-action - as opposed to
>puppet - production.

I believe he did U.F.O. before that, and anyone disparaging Space: 1999 had
better have a good look at Mr. Anderson's previous effort.  Space: 1999 has
aged quite well in comparison!  Though I must admit I still have a soft
spot in my heart for U.F.O., perhaps because it featured a multitude of
hi-tech transport vehicles (a holdover from the puppet series, I suppose).
It certainly couldn't have been the acting, which might as well have been
done by puppets!

>There seems to be a mini-revival of interest in it among media-sf fans,

Indeed--independent of this list, it's recently come up as a discussion
topic amongst some of my friends.  Perhaps because we only have two years
to build our moon base ;-)


P.S.  Speaking of SF nostalgia--has anyone read Harlan Ellison's book about
his Star Trek episode (both book and episode are called "City on the Edge
of Forever", I believe).  If so, can you provide a summary and/or a
recommendation as to whether or not it is a worthwhile read?



Date:    Tue, 21 Jan 1997 07:40:48 EST
From:   
Subject: <No subject given>

Subject:Re: Space 1999
Re: Space 1999

>I watched 1999 back in the 70s and distinctly remember the shapeshifter. She
>had these funky bumpy eyebrows. I believe that she was an alien that they ran
>into in their travels.

I believe the characters name was Myra.  She came about when they visited
her homeworld and her father, a brilliant but slightly mad scientist (a bit
of a stereotype there?) blew up their world.  She was a replacement for the
older gentleman that played the brains of the group.  Victor was his name
I believe.  Myra had the same morphing shortcomings of Odo, she couldn't
retain the shape indefinitely.

I remember very well growing up watching S:1999 and enjoying the show,
although even at that age I wondered how they were able to fix all their
hull breaches and so forth with no resupplies for years.  I think I still
have one of the Eagle ship models stuffed away somewhere!  The show became
more and more bizzare as time went on, until finally going off the air.
I remember at the time thinking the technology wasn't too far off of what
could be possible.  It looks like we have a lot of work to do in the next
2 years to get that base finished!

Anyone remember the destination they were hoping to reach?  It seems to me
they had received some signals from a distant star that the moon happened
to be heading for.  I'm not sure if it was from that ship that was sent out
earlier to explore deep space, but I do remember them listening to some
signal as a faint ray of hope.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
"Out the Token Ring, through the router, down the fiber, off another
router, down the T1, past the firewall.....nothing but Net."



Date:    Tue, 21 Jan 1997 09:35:25 -0500
From: 
Subject: Re: Space 1999 (& U.F.O!)

I think I was about ten years old when U.F.O came out. Besides loving Sci-Fi
I was also fascinated by the see-through fishnet tops the female crew wore on
the submarine! Does anyone else remember that?




Date:    Tue, 21 Jan 1997 16:41:40 GMT
From:  
Subject: Re: Space 1999 (& U.F.O!)

On Tue, 21 Jan 1997 03:46:08 -0800 wrote:

>
> >I don't know if anyone has said that Space 1999 (or Space Nineteen and
> >ninepence as it was
> >dubbed because of the apparent budget costs on the writing side) was
> >produced by Gerry
> >Anderson and was, I think, his first major live-action -
>
> I believe he did U.F.O. before that

He did indeed. So there was no excuse :-)



Date:    Tue, 21 Jan 1997 18:44:22 +0000
From:
Subject: Re: Space 1999 (& U.F.O!)

> I think I was about ten years old when U.F.O came out. Besides loving
>Sci-Fi I was also fascinated by the see-through fishnet tops the female
>crew wore on the submarine! Does anyone else remember that?

Yes I do, and what about their wigs? UFO is surely to be included in
any future museum of the psychedelic late-60s civilization...

"A commission is appointed
To confer with a Volscian commission
About perpetual peace"--and nobody told me!



Date:    Tue, 21 Jan 1997 13:06:49 EST
From:    
Subject: Re: Space 1999 (yet again)

On Jan 20,        posted, in part:

>I don't know if anyone has said that Space 1999 (or Space Nineteen and
>ninepence as it was dubbed because of the apparent budget costs on the
>writing side) was produced by Gerry Anderson and was, I think, his first
>major live-action - as opposed to puppet - production.

     While I quite agree with your assessment of the budget for Space 1999,
that show was not Gerry Anderson's first effort at live-action.  The equally
laguhable series UFO (I mean, really -- having a movie studio as a front for
a secret government organization??) preceded Space 1999 by several years.
Judging by Anderson's latest effort -- Space Precinct -- he hasn't improved any.

Regards,

 -----------------------------------------------------------------------
|                                                                       |
|            Where there's a will, I want to be in it.                  |
|                                                                       |
|                                          -- Han Solo                  |
|                                                                       |
 -----------------------------------------------------------------------



Date:    Tue, 21 Jan 1997 18:59:24 -0800
From:  
Subject: Re: Humanity as spacefaring species

>> #2) the physical limits to FTL travel. Even if
>> relativity theory appears to show some cracks and the
>> speed of light barrier may not be a barrier after all,
>> we still don't have a practical way to go, let's say
>> to Rigel or Betelgeuse, or even only Alpha Centauri in
>> a reasonable time lapse, say within three years from
>> the departure and find your folks aged the same time
>> lapse you have aged. All methods of space travel I've
>> heard of are slow, time-consuming, space-cramped and
>> over-demanding on human soul.

> I think you look a little too far in future.

> Space now should be a little exploring of the inner
> solar system : let's say the Moon, Mars, and perhaps
> Venus. We should be exploiting mineral resources on the
> moon and space factories of some kind in orbit.

> Then let's just build some nice orbiting colonies.

> We can't do FTL travel ? we can't reach the stars ?

> Right know we can't even land a probe on our nearest
> neighboors !!!! Let's start small.

        Monsieur Eric, I know as well as you do that the exploration and
the colonization of our own solar system is the very first step to reach
the stars, if we'll ever reach them. I also know that the task will
require a century, if not two or three.
        I'm no mathematician, no physicist, no engineer, I'm a
microbiologist. BUT I'm an avid reader of science fiction, mostly hard
science fiction. When I was most sensitive to such things, ie 13-17 yo,
my main staples were Clarke, Campbell, Anderson, Heinlein, (also Star
Trek, Star Wars, Space 1999, UFO and his incomparable Commander Striker)
and I was most influenced by them. My motivations are therefore
emotional, much more than rational.
        I don't care much about our solar system: I want the STARS! They
are the source of dreams, the origin of science and civilization, the
call of space. The universe is out there!



Date:    Tue, 21 Jan 1997 12:44:54 -0600
From:  
Subject: Re: Space 1999 (& U.F.O!)

On Tue, 21 Jan 1997,        wrote:

> I think I was about ten years old when U.F.O came out. Besides loving
>Sci-Fi I was also fascinated by the see-through fishnet tops the female
>crew wore on the submarine! Does anyone else remember that?

        Sure do...that, and purple wigs, and British accents; kind of warped
my ideals of attractive womanhood ;-).  For those who have forgotten, check
out the _U.F.O._ homepage:

http://www.cnw.com/~mmartin/ufo/

        I was even younger when this came out, and spent a couple of years
wondering whether the correct pronunciation for the abbreviation "U. F.
O." was to sound out each capital letter, as everyone did in Real Life, or
to say "YOU-foe," as Straker did on the show.  Proving once again that
everything one learns from television is wrong...



Date:    Wed, 22 Jan 1997 04:12:45 -0500
From:   
Subject: Re: Space: 1999

Well, well, well, I ne'er thought that *I* would be rising to the show's
defense :-)

Some of the august members of this list scoff at Space:1999 [ITV] as being
too simplistic [true] bad f/x [I dunno] etc.  Space: 1999, was, at that
time, one of the *two* SF television series at the time it was aired in
Turkey [the other being ST, and it was Star Trek, pure and simple, none of
this new-fangled TOS addition simply because there was *no* ST:NG :-)]  I
was about 6-8 at that time and understandably not very SF-literate, but I
watched all the series with interest.  The shapechanger's name, IIRC, was
Maya, and the apperant absurdity of MoonBase Alpha's one-planet per episode
speed [how many times the speed of light? :-)] was at the same level of
absurdity as the StarFleet's willingness to endanger the captain of the
Enterprise in every episode, whereas by simple logic the captain should have
been a little less expendible.  Space: 1999 was one of the things that
endeared SF to me, and the lack of "hard" scientific content I find hard to
accept *now* [I have seen some re-runs of it and they *are* bad--but I am
speaking, after all, with the prejudices of an intervening 20 years during
which I have been exposed to more quality SF and had a science/engineering
education.] it was alright for the time.  For that matter, I even liked
Battlestar Galactica, but I saw an episode on a German channel the other
day, where they were trying to put out a fire by *fire-extinguishers* I
could barely managed not to puke--even a far less advanced spaceship than
Galactica would not need extinguishers to stop a fire *from a Cylone attack*
since opening the hit section to vacuum is all they need.  Where was I, oh,
yes, 1999 and ST were a good wedge for my entry into SF, and Space:1999 was
the first place I have seen remote controls [as in opening doors] and
communicators with small video screens that we *still* don't have as
standard equipment around, with only 2 years left until 1999.  Plus, of
course, as someone else pointed out, we don't *have* a moonbase Alpha,
neither for nuclear waste damping or anything else, and this is depressing
enough by itself.  Sigh.


-- [who still has his "Space:1999" 'Eagle' on the bookshelf in front of
the RAH books] 



Date:    Wed, 22 Jan 1997 09:10:45 +0000
From: 
Subject: Re: Space 1999 (yet again)

/.     Judging by Anderson's latest effort -- Space Precinct -- he hasn't
/improved any.

/Regards,

       !

I agree the latest "Anderson" was launched over here with much ballyhoo, I
waited for it to be shown on the BBC with great anticipation. It was shown on
satellite TV before the "beeb" got it.

Result ?

It is execrable, however, my 4 year old son _loves_ it and I think they should
make more (I think it has been "axed" ) for that reason alone. He loves
anything to do with "space" or "aliens" but loses concentration with Star Trek
(NG, he seems able to follow the original !!! ) DS9 and Voyager.

But, if a show can "turn him on" to Science, Technology, and SF I think it
should be encouraged, and maybe we should begin to judge these products on a
level other than "adult". Don't get me wrong I think it is crap , but it is
possibly a mistake in the marketing of the product rather than the product
itself.

Over here it was mooted as a competitor to ST (all flavours) and Babylon 5
it patently is _not_. Although "Space above and beyond" only just beats it !!

:-)

I know I have a long way to go to "turn him on" to learning, while we were
discussing his "graduation" from nursery to "big" school (he started Jan 7), we
were talking about "learning" and "work", his stated ambition is to be ;

a A spaceman
or
b A Baywatch lifeguard

He said " why do I need to go to school for so long to be a spaceman ?, all you
have to is drive a spaceship !!. "

So Jill put down my son for the "driver" :-) .


Regards



Date:    Wed, 22 Jan 1997 12:00:13 -0800
From: 
Subject: Miscellanea

Subject: Re: Space 1999 (& U.F.O!)

                        wrote:

>> I don't know if anyone has said that Space 1999 (or
>> Space Nineteen and ninepence as it was dubbed because
>> of the apparent budget costs on the writing side) was
>> produced by Gerry Anderson and was, I think, his first
>> major live-action - as opposed to puppet - production.

> I believe he did U.F.O. before that, and anyone
> disparaging Space: 1999 had better have a good look at
> Mr. Anderson's previous effort.  Space: 1999 has aged
> quite well in comparison!  Though I must admit I still
> have a soft spot in my heart for U.F.O., perhaps
> because it featured a multitude of hi-tech transport
> vehicles (a holdover from the puppet series, I
> suppose). It certainly couldn't have been the acting,
> which might as well have been done by puppets!

        I have a soft spot in my heart for U.F.O. too, but this is
probably due to the fact that I watched it when I was a kid and
experienced with it for the first time the sense of wonder that
afterwards led me to read SF...



Subject:Re: Space 1999

> I believe the characters name was Myra.

        As a matter of fact, her name was Maya.... :)

> Anyone remember the destination they were hoping to
> reach?  It seems to me they had received some signals
> from a distant star that the moon happened to be
> heading for.  I'm not sure if it was from that ship
> that was sent out earlier to explore deep space, but I
> do remember them listening to some signal as a faint
> ray of hope.

        The leitmotiv of the series was that the Moon and Alpha Base were
looking for a planet that they could colonize after Luna's detachment
from Earth orbit. Too bad they were all unsuitable for a reason or the
other!



Subject: Re: Space 1999 (& U.F.O!)

> I think I was about ten years old when U.F.O came out.
> Besides loving Sci-Fi I was also fascinated by the see-
> through fishnet tops the female crew wore on the
> submarine! Does anyone else remember that?

        I was about the same age, Dan, and I remember noticing the same
thing. Too bad I was too young to appreciate it as it deserved!
        Quite indipendently from that, however, I'd like to watch the
series again.



Date:    Wed, 22 Jan 1997 07:26:26 EST
From: 
Subject: Re: Space 1999 (and UFO)

>> I think I was about ten years old when U.F.O came out. Besides loving Sci-Fi
>> I was also fascinated by the see-through fishnet tops the female crew wore o
>> the submarine! Does anyone else remember that?
>
>        Sure do...that, and purple wigs, and British accents; kind of warped

PMFJI but......

The purple wigs were worn by the women who ran the communication base on
the moon.  They also wore the typical fare for moon personel, silvery
dresses with short skirts.  At the time the hair was a bit of a shocker,
now it seems passe'.

I do also remember the uniforms worn by the sub crew, and also had the
same adolescent memories, but those came down a bit when I watched some of
the shows again recently.  The uniforms weren't as revealing as I had
remembered.  Proof again that some fantasies are best left alone!

While we're talking UFO, has anyone figured out how they reloaded that
moon ship with the huge missile attached to the nose?  Most of the time
they only had one shot, but I seem to remember a couple of times when
the same ship got another chance.
It's a good thing the aliens weren't smart enough to bring in more than
3 or 4 ships at a time!  Obviously invasion tactics aren't a prerequisite
to interstellar space travel!
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
"Out the Token Ring, through the router, down the fiber, off another
router, down the T1, past the firewall.....nothing but Net."



Date:    Wed, 22 Jan 1997 06:49:31 -0800
From:
Subject: Re: Space 1999 (& U.F.O!)

>P.S.  Speaking of SF nostalgia--has anyone read Harlan Ellison's book about
>his Star Trek episode (both book and episode are called "City on the Edge
>of Forever", I believe).  If so, can you provide a summary and/or a
>recommendation as to whether or not it is a worthwhile read?
Ellison's original script for "City on the Edge of Forever" is quite good
and quite different from the rewritten version that aired (it was
originally available in the book SIX SCIENCE FICTION PLAYS, but this
version has been revised from that one). Ellison begins by reprinting his
original introduction to the play (saying kind words about STAR TREK for
about the only time since) and then launches into a long screed about how
Gene Roddenberry continually misrepresented the script, how he resented
being accused of being unprofessional, etc. It does make for some engaging
reading, though I would still question if Ellison's version could have been
done within ST's limited budget, within the time constraints, and it does
have a few weak moments where the characters seem a little off. In
Ellison's version, Kirk wants Edith Keeler to live and is willing to
sacrifice his universe for her, but the logical Mr. Spock prevents him from
saving her (there is not crazed McCoy injecting himself with a dangerous
drug by accident, though there is a slimeball named Beckwith selling drugs
on the Enterprise who surprisingly saves Edith and alters future history in
the first place). Overall, a superior sf script...



Date:    Wed, 22 Jan 1997 10:28:25 -0500
From: 
Subject: Re: Miscellanea

In a message dated 97-01-22 07:42:44 EST, ngeb@fol.it (Nicola Gebendinger)
writes:

<<      I was about the same age, Dan, and I remember noticing the same
 thing. Too bad I was too young to appreciate it as it deserved!
         Quite indipendently from that, however, I'd like to watch the
 series again.
  >>

U.F.O. was running on the Sci-Fi Channel, does anyone know if it is still on?
Here's another on to think about, I distinctly remember watching a syndicated
cheapie called "Starlost" around the same time period. I watched it in the
Washington,D.C. area in the early 70s, does anyone remember that one?



Date:    Wed, 22 Jan 1997 20:40:17 -0500
From:  
Subject: Re: Space:1999 character

<I believe the characters name was Myra.>

I thought it was Maya, but that was long ago, in a place far away....



Date:    Thu, 23 Jan 1997 09:42:10 -0600
From:
Subject: Re: Space 1999 (yet again)

Does anyone remember a 1960's American TV show called, I believe, "Fireball
XL-5?  It featured marionettes as the characters in a space patrol-type
organization, who had various adventures combatting evil villians and
otherowse having strange adventures in time and space.  It is the first SF
TV show I ever remember seeing.  It ran for several years, I believe, had no
SF/X, and may even have been broadcast live.
For what it's worth, I believe it was a Saturday morning show, on the same
network as "Sky King" and "My friend Flicka."

Thanx,



Date:    Thu, 23 Jan 1997 10:42:42 -0500
From:  
Subject: Re: Space 1999 (yet again)

Yes, I do remember Fireball XL-5!! There was also a show called
Supercar, which had those dreadful marionettes bouncing around inside an
incredibly hokey high-techmobile, fighting evil. One of the good guys
was a balding, bespectacled scientist/professor, and his signature line
was "Satisfactory. Most satisfactory." Those were the days...



Date:    Thu, 23 Jan 1997 14:44:25 EST
From:
Subject: Gerry Anderson + STARLOST

On 22 Jan,            commented, in part:


>It is execrable; however, my 4 year old son _loves_ it and I think they
>should make more (I think it has been "axed" ) for that reason alone. He
>loves anything to do with "space" or "aliens" but loses concentration
>with Star Trek (NG, he seems able to follow the original !!!) DS9 and
>Voyager.

     Yes, well, there are times people do the right thing for the wrong
reason.

>But, if a show can "turn him on" to Science, Technology, and SF I think
>it should be encouraged, and maybe we should begin to judge these
>products on a level other than "adult." Don't get me wrong I think it is
>crap, but it is possibly a mistake in the marketing of the product
>rather than the product itself.

     Perhaps, but, by all accounts, these people were aiming for an ADULT
audience.  I guess you could call it a marketing mistake, in as much as
they utterly misjudged the audience they were actually reaching.

     Does anyone know what audience Gerry Anderson himself intended to
reach?  Is the fault in the marketing or in the scriptwriter, or rather,
the whole gestalt of story editor and producers and director?

=========================================================================

     and then,               remarked:

>Here's another on to think about, I distinctly remember watching a
>syndicated cheapie called "Starlost" around the same time period. I
>watched it in the Washington,D.C. area in the early 70s, does anyone
>remember that one?


     Yes, I remember "STARLOST."  It was another of those incidents that
raises Harlan Ellison's blood-pressure when he talks about his adventures
in TV-land.  A Canadian outfit hired Ellison to create the series, to
write the show's "bible" and all; but they royally shafted him from the
outset.  Hence, he took his name off the show and substituted a
pseudonym, "Cordwainer Bird" in the credits, disowning the entire project
thereby.
 -----------------------------------------------------------------------
|                                                                       |
|     Don't take life so seriously; you won't get out of it alive.      |
|                                                                       |
|                                          -- Dorian Grey               |
|                                                                       |
 -----------------------------------------------------------------------



Date:    Thu, 23 Jan 1997 14:36:23 -0500
From:
Subject: MISC

>Does anyone remember a 1960's American TV show called, I believe, "Fireball
XL-5? For what it's worth, I believe it was a Saturday morning show, on the
same network as "Sky King" and "My friend Flicka."


Uh.  Yes.  I remember that, but for some reason only the title, and reading
it triggered some aural memory.  The intro, maybe?  <sigh>  A wisp, and then
it's gone... The show must not have made a big impression.  I was more into
planes and horses at the time.  And Mounties, maybe.  Who was that guy, Sgt.
Preston?  And his dog, King. <g>



Date:    Fri, 24 Jan 1997 09:47:10 AHST
From:
Subject: Re: Fireball XL-5, et. al.

In Message Fri, 24 Jan 1997 11:23:24 EST,
 writes:
>     Going back a tad further, does anybody remember "Commando Cody"?

no, only the 60s-70s name-derivative rock group "Commander Cody & his Lost
Planet Airmen" -  (8>)  (yes, i wear glasses)
i've often wondered if east coast & west coast offerings were significantly
different in the early days of saturday morning kids programming.  i
remember "crusader rabbit" very clearly (east), & my husband was a "brother
buzz" fan (west), & we are totally clueless to each other's shows.  anyone
else find this?? - jill in alaska.



Date:    Fri, 24 Jan 1997 22:25:07 -0800
From:
Subject: Re: Fireball XL-5, et. al.

wrote:
>     Going back a tad further, does anybody remember "Commando Cody"?
>Not the Republic serial, but a Saturday-morning TV show that used the
>Republic props -- sort of the "Lone Ranger" in space.  He wore a mask,
>anyway.

Yes! if this is what I remember correctly he had a jet pack and a belt
control, and would fly in and out of the scene of trouble - man I *loved*
that guy! Inspired my own sf writing in some weird way. And let us not
forget the animated wonder, "Space Angels".  And Astroboy and Gigantor...
Early anime.
Gosh, where are these reruns when I'm craving them?? Kitschy as some of this
stuff appears nowadays it is undeniable that it fed the mill of imagination
for many young-and-future SF fans, myself included, and somewhere these
images are still kicking around, inspiring current and future writing as
well.... what an incestuous business worlds of the imagination can be.
-Deborah Christian
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
author of
MAINLINE (Tor 96) * KAR KALIM (Tor 97)



Date:    Sat, 25 Jan 1997 12:08:27 -0500
From:
Subject: Re: Fireball XL-5, et. al.

<<  Going back a tad further, does anybody remember "Commando Cody"?
Not the Republic serial, but a Saturday-morning TV show that used the
Republic props -- sort of the "Lone Ranger" in space.  He wore a mask,
anyway.

Regards,


Yes. But I thought it was "Commander Cody". Wasn't it sponsored by Ovaltine?
I even had the "secret decoder ring"!



Date:    Sat, 25 Jan 1997 20:30:32 -0800
From:
Subject: Re: Fireball XL-5, et. al.

     wrote:
>     Ah, yes. And "Supercar" and "Stingray" (the above, but underwater)
>and "Thunderbirds" (high-tech rescues) and "Captain Scarlett" (gallant
>space-patrol types defending Earth against invaders.  Cary Grant provided
>the voice for one character).  Then the producer -- Gerry Anderson --
>moved on to live-action with "UFO" and "Space: 1999" and "Space Precinct."
>If I remember correctly, TV Guide once did a feature on the puppets.
>
>     Going back a tad further, does anybody remember "Commando Cody"?
>Not the Republic serial, but a Saturday-morning TV show that used the
>Republic props -- sort of the "Lone Ranger" in space.  He wore a mask,
>anyway.
>
>Regards,

Sorry,     , but Cary Grant did nothing of the kind--that was a Grant
imitator you heard (something like supposing that the voice of Ape in
George of the Jungle was supplied by Ronald Colman). I've heard about
Commander Cody (And His Lost Planet Airmen) from references books, and from
the rock group named after him in the '60s. I used to watch THUNDERBIRDS
with great interest, was amused that when Anderson filmed SPACE: 1999, he
managed to find actors as wooden as his marionettes. If anyone remembers
the lyrics to the theme from "Fireball XL-5," then you know Anderson's
grasp of science was very unsure (about as bad as Astro Boy past the stars,
on his way out to Mars). There's an article on Anderson's early shows in
the recent issue of Outré magazine for anyone who is interested.



Date:    Sun, 26 Jan 1997 13:41:46 EST
From:
Subject: Re: Fireball XL-5, et. al.

On Fri, 24 Jan 1997,             wrote:

>Yes! if this is what I remember correctly he had a jet pack and a belt
>control, and would fly in and out of the scene of trouble - man I *loved*
>that guy! Inspired my own sf writing in some weird way. And let us not
>forget the animated wonder, "Space Angels".  And Astroboy and Gigantor...
>Early anime.

     Actually, I think the control for Cody's jet pack was on his chest,
but it sounds like you've got the guy pegged.  Remember those ghastly
"cartoons" "Clutch Cargo" and "Scott McCloud, Space Angel" -- wherein the
characters' lips were live-action and the rest very stilted animation?
Actually, they were more like still pictures that were moved in front of
the camaera rather than being truly animated.
     Then there were two super-hero shows -- Shazam (Capt. Marvel) and a
super-heroine -- not Wonder Woman (I forget the show's name).  The
character assumed the name Isis with her super-powers, sort of like a
female Billy Batson.

>Gosh, where are these reruns when I'm craving them?? Kitschy as some of this
>stuff appears nowadays it is undeniable that it fed the mill of imagination
>for many young-and-future SF fans, myself included, and somewhere these
>images are still kicking around, inspiring current and future writing as
>well.... what an incestuous business worlds of the imagination can be.

     Know what you mean.  You look at Saturday morning stuff nowadays and
it seems badly lacking in imagination.  "Bump In the Night" was rather
fun, though.  Don't know if it's still on.



Date:    Mon, 27 Jan 1997 11:52:33 EST
From:
Subject: Re: Fireball XL-5, et al

On Sat, 25 Jan            wrote:


>>>  Going back a tad further, does anybody remember "Commando Cody"? Not
the Republic serial, but a Saturday-morning TV show that used the
Republic props -- sort of the "Lone Ranger" in space.  He wore a mask,
anyway. <<<

>Yes. But I thought it was "Commander Cody". Wasn't it sponsored by
Ovaltine? I even had the "secret decoder ring"! <

     Maybe you're thinking of "Captain Midnight," played on TV by Richard
Webb.  "Captain Midnight" was a radio show, too, earlier, also sponsored
by Ovaltine.  I guess maybe Ovaltine must have owned the rights to the
character, because after they stopped sponsoring the show, it suddenly
became "Jet Jackson."
     I think the radio "Captain" had the decoder ring; the TV version had
a plastic, jet-shaped pin that you used to decode their secret messages.



It seems to me the thread has stopped after these messages.
I havn't found any new Gerry Anderson messages on SF lit for
the last three days.  I was hoping for more discussion of UFO
and 1999 but from what I read it seems at least not everyone
remembers the shows I like so much with distaste.
It seems there are a couple of fans out there as well.

My thanks to the moderator of the S Lit list for giving me
permission to repost these messages.

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