[EDITOR'S NOTE:  Starts on topic, drifts off, then back on again.]


Date: Tue, 11 Mar 1997 15:23:54 +0000 From: HANSENS KITCHEN EQUIPMENT Subject: Space1999: Where did the Alphans end up? Hi all. I'm sure this has been discussed before, but how do the rest of you picture the Alphans ending up? Did they settle on The Immunity Syndrome planet, or were they rescued? Do you think John/Helena and Tony/Maya stayed together? Are they still out there somewhere, floating through space, living their lives with that wonderful disco soundtrack echoing in the background!? I live in the UK (London) now and have access to the ITC videos, but grew up in Canada where Space:1999 was aired on the CBC. After it was cancelled TV Ontario (French version) picked it up and I watched repeats in French for several years (Cosmos:1999!). The one thing I knew would never get lost in translation was the "you know something exciting is about to happen" disco music. Think how many security guards could have been saved from vaporisation if only they’d been able to hear that music. "Uh, oh - disco!! GET DOWN!" It could have served as a musical Early Warning System. Sorry, getting silly… Alison Braidwood
Date: Tue, 11 Mar 1997 13:13:36 -0500 From: Marcy Kulic (mkulic@wizard44.com) Subject: Re: Space1999: Where did the Alphans end up? Welcome Alison! There has been much speculation about this, but obviously no one has the answers. Officially no, as the last episode of Y2 was The Dorcons, and ITC was hoping for a third season. There has been some great fan fiction on the issue, some of which is up in the Cyber Museum, http://space1999.net in The Work of Today's Alphans section. My favorite ending type story is Philippa Sidle's long one which name aludes me at the time. It is a 1999/ST:TNG crossover which I really enjoyed despite not being much of a ST:TNG fan. There are also some other great stories by Ellen Lindow available there. David Welle is working on some stories too. His first one was excellent, but doesn't resolve the Alphan's wandering. >Think how many security guards could have >been saved from vaporisation if only they’d been able to hear that >music. "Uh, oh - disco!! GET DOWN!" It could have served as a musical >Early Warning System. You're right. Kind of like the riffs in the Friday the 13th type movies, when you want to shout at the dumb bimbo, "Don't go in there!". Marcy
Hi Alison - Welcome to the list. The issue of, Where did the Alphans end up? was never addressed in the 48 TV episodes, much to the delight of fiction writers (both professional and fan fic) and much to the dismay of viewers like me who would scrupulously serach the TV Guide for a "movie-of-the-week" that ended the Alphans' plight. Several answers from different sources have been proposed 1) Earthfall, by E.C. Tubb (skip this is you're inclined to read it and don't know or don't want to know the ending) - The moon never left orbit, but was catapulted into another dimension/alternative universe by the huge amount of energy that was generated by the nuclear reactions. After enough energy bled off, the ended up back in Earth's orbit, some time in the future. Whether they did, in fact, evacuate to the somewhat changed world was not written, but one could probably assume that they had. In the meantime, they started a new generation of Alphans, recognizing the fact that they were not immortal. 2) Edge of the Infinite - The Immunity Syndrome was not the last episode produced, though it was the last in the series of Warner books. At the end of the story, the Alphans were left looking around at this now-innocuous planet, wondering if they could settle there, after all. That's how it was left...the rest is up to you. 3) Children of the Gods - The episode that wasn't. Written by Johnny Byrne, it is the story of two little superpowered brats that wreak havoc on the Alphans. Turns out they are their descendents, back from the future, and do not know that the Alphans are their progenitors. While this does not directly say the Alphans settled down someplace, it implies that they must have, or else these kids would never have existed. This story was rejected in favor of The Dorcons for the final episode of Y2, although many - Mr. Byrne included - feel this would have been a better final episode had they known Y3 was truly out of the picture. At least there was some hint of finality. As for me, I always liked the concept that they never found a planet (I think at the end of Matter of Life and Death, Kano had come up with some ridiculous figures regarding the number of planets they would come across in their trajectory and the age they would be when they reached the first; this observation was swiftly ignored and they came across another real quick), and therefore they eventually had to expand using raw materials they scavenged from the odd wandering meteor/comet/derelict, and started allowing births. BTW, to you and other potential posters, don't let the idea that something has already been discussed dissuade you from bringing up a topic. The list is very dynamic, and so many people have never had the opportunity to submit their views, or read others' views. After all, how many time has the Y1 vs. Y2 string reared its head? Pat. Sokol
From: Brian Dowling (brian.dowling@drugnet44.co.uk) Subject: Space1999: Where did Alpha end up? Date: Tue, 11 Mar 1997 21:55:00 GMT I'd be a little disappointed if the journey ever finished. For me, the whole adventure is the journey through unknown space, encountering all sorts of things previously unknown to humanity. I'd see Alpha developing as the journey went on, the base's capacity to sustain life increased, so that beings from other races could join, and Alphans could have children, thus ensuring that Alpha had a future. That's why 1999 will always be a cut above ST:Voyager. They're trying to go home, and exploring just because they have nothing better to do on the way, rather than looking to go further out and explore. Therefore, the crew of Voyager, led by Captain Conehead (sorry folks, but Janeway sounds like Prymaat, Dan Aykroyd's wife in "Coneheads") are motivated by the fact that some day, they will get home, unlike the Alphans, who are looking for a home, which necessitates exploration. Somehow, Alpha strikes me as a better example of being alone in space than Voyager. Hmm... that's got me thinking about a "Who's better" list... Koenig v Janeway Dr Russell v Emergency Medical Holographic Program Alan Carter v Tom Paris Paul v Chakotay Tony v Tuvok Does that mean it's Maya v Neelix?!? Thoughts, anyone?
From: "Peters, Pete" (BPeters@gwinnett.tec44.ga.us) Subject: RE: Space1999: Where did Alpha end up? Date: Wed, 12 Mar 1997 16:27:59 -0500 >Koenig v Janeway Koenig any day, any where,any how, any when!!!!! >Dr Russell v Emergency Medical Holographic Program Real hard decision I'd have to team them up, let them work together, and then decide. Who knows EMHP might fall in love! >Alan Carter v Tom Paris Need both, great tension and competition. >Paul v Chakotay Chakotay definitely, Paul's to hot headed, you need someone w/self control and intelligent cunning. >Tony v Tuvok Apples vs. oranges, to different, can't decide. Tony for humor and pizaaz. Tuvok for continuity and foundation. >Does that mean it's Maya v Neelix?!? Maya.....Neelix can go jump into an empty turbo shaft.
From: "Mark Meskin" (plastic.gravity@newrock44.com) To: "'Space 1999 Chat Group'" (space1999@buffnet4.buffnet.net) Subject: Re: Space1999: Where did Neelix end up? Date: Tue, 2 Jan 1996 19:54:10 -0600 I was thinking shove him into a torpedo tube. Whoa! Hit the "fire" button there.......oops, sorry.. Neelix is the Wesley Crusher of Voyager............but not as good as saving the ship.
Date: Thu, 13 Mar 1997 02:26:52 +0000 From: Ina Litera (ilitera@idt44.net) Subject: Space1999: Voyager comparisson Someone recently was making comparissons between S19 and Voyager (I accidently deleted it). This got me thinking as to why I haven't been overwhelmed by Voyager. I think it is because the personnal seem so relaxed(or at least not to bothered ) about thier predicament. On S19, many of the characters seemed on the edge (David Wells recently refered to Koenning as being on the edge of a nervous breakdown). Even when externally they acted like everything was OK one got the feeling that they were pretty stressed out (Just my opinion) Anyway On Voyager,I constitently get the feeling that everyone is dealing with theire situation just fine even though they know it's really hopeless. Just a thought. I'm off to Paris for a few days. See you all next week. Later Ina
From: "Jonathan Ward" (JWard@lonet44.ca) Subject: Re: Space1999: Voyager comparisson Date: Thu, 13 Mar 1997 09:46:06 -0500 As soon as ST: Voyager hit the waves in 1995, I think, it immediately struck me as a ripoff of the much superior Space: 1999. Instead of a moon they were on a TACKY looking ship! The only character I like on Voyager is Tuvok, but he reminds me of Spock too much. That's probably why I like him. But with 1999, I like a great deal of the characters and unlike Voyager, 1999 episodes aren't painful to watch, nor do they induce sleep! :) BTW, what Gentle Mike said about Star Trek TOS being the REAL Trek, I agree 100%.
From: ARIMMR@aol44.com Date: Thu, 13 Mar 1997 15:56:30 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: Space1999: Voyager comparisson I agree,everyone on voyager is so happy(they must put tranquilizers in the food or something).I had a hard time believing the marquee(you know the pirate guys)just joined up with the starfleet crew put on the uniforms and then acted like they had always been part of starfleet.(yes there were one or two episodes where they tried to show the problems with this ,but they seemed really forced).space 1999 seemed to show the desperation better(will we have enough feul to go on,will we live to find a new home etc)And believe me i have watched voyager(i believe in giving every show a chance(i do like star trek,stng and ds9 as well as lots of other sci/fi)well enuogh for now,back to lurk mode. lynn laakso
From: Brian Dowling (brian.dowling@drugnet44.co.uk) Subject: Space1999: Space1999 v Voyager Date: Thu, 13 Mar 1997 20:23:00 GMT Regarding ST:Voyager, Jon wrote... >As soon as ST: Voyager hit the waves in 1995, I think, it immediately >struck me as a ripoff of the much superior Space: 1999. That was the first thing I said when I heard about the concept, and repeated when the series came out. It just didn't do anything for me in the same way that 1999, Blake's 7 et al did. More like being hit around the knees with a wet smoked haddock, it begs the question "Why?". And Mel Brooks answers that in "Spaceballs" when he says "With any luck, we'll all meet up again in Spaceballs 2: The Search For More Money"! >Instead of a moon they were on a TACKY looking ship! Hey c'mon! What chance did they stand trying to compete with the Eagle? >The only character I like on Voyager is Tuvok, but he reminds me of >Spock too much. That's probably why I like him. Some of the acting is very good. Tim Russ is outstanding as Tuvok, but that would only appeal to Vulcan fans. Robert Picardo is excellent as the HoloDoc, and even if the episode is a bad one, there might just be a line from the HoloDoc to make it worth watching. Other than that, I'm not too struck on it really. And my 70 year old grandmother absolutely hates it! They're going to need to do a lot better, or soon lots of ST fans are going to realise that they're being taken for a ride...
From: NicStepro@aol44.com Date: Sat, 15 Mar 1997 12:33:18 -0500 (EST) Subject: Re: Space1999: Where did the Alphans end up? One thing that the Y2 novels bought out more was their absolute NEED to colonize somewhere. In year 1, they would encounter hostile outside forces- but the food/life support necessities were shelved into the background. Y2 had more of a sense of desperation (making the humor a bit incongruous) as the threat of total depletion of 'tiranium'/titanium loomed ever-present in the background. They really can't float out there forever; even a motherload of essential minerals will eventually run out... Nicolette
Date: Sat, 15 Mar 1997 14:51:57 From: David Welle (dwelle@online.dct44.com) Subject: Re: Space1999: Where did the Alphans end up? >Y2 had more of a sense of desperation I agree. I always thought that they seemed closer on the edge. >(making the humor a bit incongruous) Maybe not so incongruous after all, at least in the sense that from a psychological viewpoint, humor and other feelings of community were absolutely needed to stave off those same feelings of desperation, loss, pain, etc. I have a saying that I most often use at work: "I'd rather laugh than cry or pound the desk or scream obscenities." I program computers, and bugs (errors) in a programs can make it do very strange things. Bugs are inevitable: the more carefully you program, the fewer bugs you'll have, but they'll always be a few--and some will be hard to eliminate (even taking days on some occasions). It can be real easy to get frustrated, especially with the persistent ones; but when I get random characters on the screen, or it blows up and automatically reboots the computer, or prints a diagonal line of characters instead of my report, or rotates every character individually 90 degress, etc., I just kind of smile and/or laugh at how funny/silly it looks as I start to debug the problem. I'd rather do this than pound my hand sore in frustration, or bother others with obscenities. A sense of humor is a valuable thing, and is often useful in coping with tragic or troublesome situations. This is what I saw in Y2: that they were diffusing and/or masking their pain and fears with humor. This, and other means of drawing together and lightening the mood and providing each other support, made plenty of sense to me. Not that I didn't like the philosophical ending of Y1--but each incident only seemed to leave the Alphans more and more depressed, IMO; and I wondered how they could keep such shells around them without eventually cracking wide open. > as the threat of total depletion of 'tiranium'/titanium loomed > ever-present in the background. If not that, then it was some other mineral. They were constantly looking for things. >They really can't float out there forever; >even a motherload of essential minerals >will eventually run out... I always pictured the Alphans as eventually finding a home, though I've never really made up my mind exactly when (or whether it's even within the same generation), since there are SO MANY interesting possibilities to consider. But by the time they settled, out of desperation (accumulated damage, dwindling resources, declining population--assuming they didn't find some ways of reversing these factors), the Alphans would have been wandering for so long that they'd simply retain a measure of "wanderlust." After all, the original Alphans had come to the moon to explore; even most of the caretakers of the nuclear facility or other non-astronomical pursuits probably had some desire or interest to head into space to pursue their interests. For all the knocks that the Alphans took, they seemed reasonably well-suited for space travel. They'd have never survived that long if they hadn't been. So the desire to explore--first out of curiosity (while still in the Earth/Moon system), then curiosity AND necessity (got to check out this new planet we're crusing by) was essentially ingrained in Alpha as a whole, even if some individuals eventually gained a phobia to space flight. Travel obviously was part of Alpha, and became part of its culture. Even if they settled on a planet, I always pictured them retaining some sense of this, as well as some of the space flight technology. I figured that given what we saw in later Y2 episodes, that they were figuring out how to maneuver the Moon to some degree, but didn't want to do that often for the chance of destroying Alpha or even shattering the Moon. One new part they may have added during Y2 to the Operation Exodus master plan is some contingency that once they committed themselves to Exodus, that they'd make some plans to set off some portion of whatever nuclear material remained. As a key side note, I always figured there were *several* nuclear waste storage areas developed over time before Breakaway, each one closed when decisions to relocate or use new methods were made. There were not just two. Area One was the initial, essentially experimental (IMO) site, closed early and moved to Area Two. A2 accumulated a much larger amount before new storage methods were employed for an Area 3 (my name) seen in "Seance Spectre" (those hole-like pits), or then the new dome technology used in Area 4 (again, my name), later seen in "Bringers of Wonder." All had to be monitored carefully. The older storage areas may have been the absolute worst ways to store the waste, eventually leading to the first "small" pre-Breakaway explosion and then Breakaway itself. The storage technology in the newer areas (which I'm assuming were already being built before Breakaway) was likely better from human terms, but also (perhaps coincidentally) from the standpoint of making a Breakaway-like explosion more unlikely than in the older areas. Now the area seen in "Bringers of Wonder" was never exploded, and the aliens intended such a large that it would have killed all of the Alphans. So perhaps this area wasn't good for course change attempts. But say there was a fifth area just under construction--or even a fifth or sixth area that the Alphans were dumping their *own* post-Breakaway nuclear waste at (carefully of course :-). Now Operation Exodus, as we came to know it, was the complete evacuation of Alpha along with as much material and equipment as possible--total abandonment of Alpha, with the Moon still cruising into space and out of reach. But even under the best of circumstances, by the time the determination was made that some planet was habitable and safe enough, the actual time of Exodus would have been quite limited before the Moon went out of range. Quite a lot would have gotten left behind, especially all the large power generation and manufacturing abilities. I'd suggest that a new modifying contingency was added after the "Seance Spectre." The course seen in that episode was made out of desperation to avoid colliding with something that would have destroyed Alpha (there was no hint of intelligent force /a la/ Arra of Astheria in "Collision Course" to suggest a mitigating factor). But though forced into that decision in that incident, it may have suggested something new that could be added to Operation Exodus plans: once everyone was evacuated along with everything they could take in the limited time, and were safely away--set off some remaining nuclear store, attempting to keep the Moon within the same star system. What would they have to lose? Alpha, the Moon, and all the remaining nuclear waste stores would have gone sailing out into the galaxy again, wasted as far as the Alphans were concerned (well, maybe the waste part would have been seen as "good riddance once and for all", but what about the rest of the Moon and particularly Alpha?) But if the plan worked, the Moon was not shattered, and it stayed within reach (I'm not at all suggesting around the actual planet of settlement itself, just within the star system), they Alphans would have the best of both worlds: all of what they had before; plus a new world. Imagine if the Alphans had keep some space flight capacity, and a mostly shut-down but still accessible Alpha, with all of its bigger, unmovable capacities: power plants, essentially all manufacturing capabilities, and whatever else couldn't be moved (can anyone think of any other examples?). Most people would of course have to be on the planet, settling, learning to farm, putting down roots, etc., much as seen in "Another Time, Another Place." Few people could really be spared to keep the old Alpha going; but even if mostly shutdown (or entirely shut down for awhile), it could still serve some uses, and perhaps be slowly repaired/restored/reactivated/etc. as the population grew on the new planet. Likewise, while some Eagles might get cannabilized (maybe the ones that had always had some problems, and were considered the most unsafe), others could be put in cold storage on Alpha or the planet, while a few were actively maintained. This would free up more people for settlement/farming/whatever, while not totally removing their atmospheric and space flight capabilities. In this way, they would not have to go as completely agrarian as seen in "Another Place, Another Time." Then, over the generations, as population increased, greater attention could be given could be given to the capabilities that old Alpha presented, and the resources they'd still have available on the Moon. The stories of space travel would be told and written, firing the imaginations of Alphan descendents, keeping the interest in space alive--not only in the sense of maintaining a connection to the old Moon still orbiting their new star, but perhaps the memories of deep space itself). Later, with greater population (and having maintained a grasp on technology), the people could afford to re-expand back to Alpha's old capacity, repair stored Eagles, reactivate more of Alpha. They'd have far greater population, resources, and time than Alpha did--and would have probably been free (for that time at least) of any threats from space. Now, with more resources and population available, and with the technological expertise having remained in the population, it would not be so hard to reactivate Alpha, repair any accumulated damage, reclaim all the Eagles that were keep in storage, and resumed a degree of space flight capacity, and started developing new techniques, even *expanding* Alpha and even adding new types of ships, and perhaps resuming deep space exploration. Best of both worlds? Alphan technology, some brought to the new world, some too big to be moved and left on an Alpha that was kept around. Alphan technology, partially maintained on the new world by some portion of the population. Old Alphan technological methods, being put to use on the new planet over time. Alphan technology, with some new developments added over time--syntheses of bits of alien technologies from projects started back on Alpha itself and continued on the planet and perhaps later old Alpha again: the crashed ships, Jim Haines (and others?) decyphering the information in black boxes from "Voyager's Return", Maya or her children eventually figuring how to bridge--in some small ways--the *huge* gap between Earth technology and the tech of Psychon, other aliens who may have been welcomed to Alpha after Y2 but before they settled, etc. The Alphans (or whatever they'd be calling themselves by this time) would have been like some of the cultures in Earth history that were exposed to many things, and eventually came up with their own synthesis and new ideas that went even further than any of the cultures around them. Over centuries, having kept and expanded the technology and having keep the dream and love of space (people often forget the worst over time, or are selective in what they listen to) they could have started exploding out into space from their new world and old, now expanded Alpha (and any bases built on other planets or moons within their star system). Having been nearly driven to extinction on Alpha, with a member (Maya) whose world was destroyed, the rest having known of an Earth that was dying itself ("Another Time, Another Place" *and* "Journey to Where"--two different realities showing devastated Earths), and having settled on a new world that they undoubtedly struggled to learn, adapt to, and later thrive on (and it might not have even been that easy! :-), one could imagine the Alphan descendents not wanting to be confined to the vagaries of fate on a single world. And imagine something on top of that: that a couple hundred years down the line, because orbits are chaotic, or something heavy cruised through the new star system somewhere near the orbiting Moon, or an unexpected explosion of a now hundred-year-old tachyon generator that suddenly generated a whole bunch of massive bosons that pushed the old Moon out of its orbit, or a space warp opened up and swallowed the Moon--that the Moon, with say nineteen hundred residents on a very expanded Alpha and/or new lunar settlements, is sent back into deep space, to become a seed once again, while leaving behind a now stable settlement that really no longer needed the Moon *that* badly anyway. Corny, perhaps; but maybe not so much, considering all we/they saw. Either way (or better yet, *both* ways), Arra's prophecy for the Alphans (from "Collision Course") would be fulfilled. (From "Collision Course", one of my favorite Y1 episodes:) Arra: Oh poor John Koenig. How you belittle yourself in the scheme of things. And yet how small you all to be so great. [....] Koenig: On this... question of the destiny of man. Please be more specific. What will happen to us? Arra: You shall continue on. Your odyssey shall know no end. You will prosper and increase in new worlds, new galaxies. You will populate the deepest reaches of space. More specific, maybe; but it *still* explained little. How would the Alphans have been able to fulfill the final statements if they were so close to the edge of doom? Well, this was one idea. [A 'Brief' "History" of Alpha *After* Exodus? (Another in what's becoming for me a series of "'Brief' Histories? :-) ] So, whatcha all think? Make any sense? Nonsense? It's my 1.999 cents, anyway... (A saying borrowed from a year-old post--I *love* this saying, and don't know why it never caught on). Eagle Four Out.... ---- David Welle